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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Aug 6, 2011 9:02pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: limited by the audience?

I enjoy a good deal of the bands repertoire,and at no point stated what I like as being better than anything.I also suggested no changes in the way they performed or presented their music,as a matter of fact I questioned why folks could not accept the music for what it is.I find it a shame that the band felt it did not have the audiences support in exploring their music to the fullest.

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Poster: bkidwell Date: Aug 6, 2011 10:10pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: limited by the audience?

I didn't mean to sound like I was projecting judgments or opinions onto your post. The process of discussing the band always involves expressing preferences and making both positive and critical statements, if I make a "contrasting point" I'm not necessarily trying to invalidate the statement I'm responding to. I appreciate your extensive listening to the band, your understanding of adventurous jazz, and the perspective you bring to your comments - just like I believe different tastes than mine are valid, I wasn't intending to negate anything you said.

I also feel the same way you do - in a more perfect world, the band's audience would have had even deeper musical understanding, and the band would had been able to dig more deeply into some elements of the music. After all, this branch of discussion was started by me "complaining" about how the band never learned a technique for a smooth extended transition between distant keys which don't share chords or a tonic note.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Aug 7, 2011 8:44am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: limited by the audience?

I would have to say that your that your post did seem very judgmental,and also seemed to address points I did not make, rather directly,so it seemed that I had made said points.I understand how the back and forth of the conversation here works and at no time took issue with anything in your responses,you could not be a more of a live and let live person than I am,I always enjoy our conversation and find your viewpoints on the music fresh and original,this time it seemed we were having two different conversations.It was not a big deal,just confusing.

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Poster: bkidwell Date: Aug 7, 2011 9:41am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: limited by the audience?

Yeah, I understand the confusion. A lot of times, when I respond to a post, I'm not necessarily responding to the post itself, I'm responding to my own thoughts that the post triggered, not the post itself, if that makes sense. Sometimes I think "interesting post" and click reply and then listen to the GD for thirty minutes while letting my thoughts wander and then write starting from where my thoughts have arrived. Usually there is a connection but its often somewhat indirect. I should try to make it more clear when I'm responding to something specific someone else wrote.

I have a lot of inner dialog about things like artistic purity vs. popularity, whether Beethoven really is as great as I perceive or if I'm just caught up in an outdated musical value system, memories of debates I've had with musicians I was collaborating with about how much dissonance and tension was right for a performance or composition - all kinds of issues in musical aesthetics I think are challenging to resolve.

To unwrap a few more layers, when I say something like "everyone's musical taste is valid" I don't always really believe it. On a purely experiential level, its hard not to perceive my own evaluations of good and bad as representing something objective. The nature of the art of music isn't exactly arbitrary, there is a lot of "scientific fact" about the physics of sound and how humans perceive music on the neurological level that create the framework for how music works.

Anyway, I have this big ongoing internal dialog and debate about some issues related to all these questions about what the "musical ideal" of Grateful Dead music is, how that relates to the art of music as a whole, how individual listeners respond - and your post triggered that topic for me, so what I posted ended up having more to do with my own internal debate on related subjects than what you said specifically.

This post was modified by bkidwell on 2011-08-07 16:41:07

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Aug 7, 2011 12:30pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: limited by the audience?

Understood bkidwell,the waters here can get murky on occasion,I'm fairly sure I have left a few people scratching their heads.